“It’s very sad to see the United States like this,” says the scholar as she analyzes how Donald Trump is targeting immigrants and attacks universities. She believes that if the president succeeds in overpowering the judges who have so far restrained him, the outlook for democracy will grow truly dark. Vallejo is an expert on the Latino middle class, which feels threatened, and she denies that all of them voted for Trump, as is often ironically claimed. The support came primarily from low-income, low-educated Latino men. “But that is changing,” she asserts.

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Proofreading: Mark Briam/ Aquí, la versión en español. Here, the Spanish version

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-There are days when I can’t sleep or eat. Now it’s our turn to go through things that Latin America has suffered many times. It’s very sad to see the United States like this. But we will keep on fighting.

This concludes the interview with Jody Agius Vallejo, a leading North American sociologist who serves as the Associate Director at the Centre for the Study of Immigrant Integration at the University of Southern California. Her book Barrios to Burbs (2012) was the first to document the existence of a Mexican-American middle class and explain their strategies for upward mobility. Today, Vallejo studies Latino elites (bankers, industrialists, prominent merchants) who are part of the wealthiest 1%; she explores how they made their way up and how they relate to their own ethnic groups. She has found that, unlike the elites in our countries, wealthy Latinos in the U.S. are socially committed to their less fortunate compatriots and are actively involved in expanding the Latino middle class. In a world where social mobility tends to fail, this interview reveals strategies and factors that have helped Mexican immigrants overcome the challenges of integrating into a highly competitive society. Key among them is access to quality public education and the very legal status that gives them the peace of mind they need to live and fulfil opportunities.

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But this interview also addresses the impact of President Donald Trump’s policies on Latino communities, academia, and, more profoundly, on American democracy. Vallejo believes that US democracy is at risk and that the key battle is being fought over immigration. Trump has, so far, deployed a series of measures to target undocumented immigrants, and until now, some judges have managed to curtail his actions. But Trump persists, and the researcher believes that if he succeeds in bending the courts to his will, he will extend his authoritarian strategies to many other areas.

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“Trump´s administration has set its sights not only on undocumented immigrants but also on legal residents.”

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Another dangerous front for democracy has opened in universities, with Trump’s decision to cut funding for academics or institutions that do not comply with certain government policies. Vallejo explains that research on diversity, equity, and inclusion is under grave threat to the point where these are concepts that no one wanting to secure research funding ought to use.

What is your assessment of these first months of Donald Trump’s second administration? Which events will have the greatest long-term impact?

-This has been a truly difficult period in the U.S., especially for those of us in academia or in the media. Like many citizens, I believe that what is happening with immigration is a litmus test for our democracy because, on this issue, Trump’s authoritarian tendencies have been deployed very aggressively. In just the first 100 days, he has issued 175 executive orders on immigration, compared to 30 during the same period in his first term. Many of these actions have been blocked or overturned by the courts, and some are even reaching the Supreme Court. It’s important to note that many of the judges ruling against Trump’s decisions are conservatives: they were put in place by Trump himself during his first administration or by earlier conservative presidents like Ronald Reagan.

“The expansion of military control over immigration at our border is also deeply troubling. Our military is being turned inward in an unprecedented way. We are witnessing attacks on due process and constitutional rights, and the Trump administration has set its sights not only on pursuing undocumented immigrants but also on legal permanent residents. There are citizens who have been deported, detained, and subjected to raids by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE). And this seems to be just the beginning, because Trump has promised mass deportations. So far, he hasn’t been able to carry them out due to a lack of funds and infrastructure, but he is using the federal government to advance that goal. He is creating lists of undocumented individuals, legal permanent residents, and even citizens. To do this, he is using databases from the IRS, Social Security (a public benefits program for the elderly or disabled), and the Office of Refugee Resettlement (which has a database of unaccompanied minors who arrived at the U.S.-Mexico border).”

“Additionally, the Department of Homeland Security has been reactivating agreements with local police departments acting as immigration agents. The same is being done with state agencies like the National Guard or the Department of Fish and Wildlife. So, we are seeing very concerning patterns of behaviour—ones that many of us consider authoritarian.”

How have Latin American communities experienced this period?

-Trump built his campaign on the false premise that there is a crisis at the Mexican border, which was supposedly allowing Latino criminals to freely enter the U.S. en masse. Trump has used this racist and dehumanizing rhetoric to desensitize Americans and to normalize his inhumane detention and deportation policies. One thing that isn’t often mentioned, however, is that most undocumented immigrants in the U.S. have been in the country for over 10 years and are deeply embedded within their respective communities, the labour market, and the school system.

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“Republicans used to support immigration because the work of undocumented people benefited them.”

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“Trump’s actions have created a climate of fear among the Latino population. Many live in mixed-status families, so the fear doesn’t just affect the undocumented but also people who have long been settled in the U.S. Some have chosen not to leave their homes and aren’t even sending their children to school. For example, in California, there was a drop in school attendance after Trump revoked a memo that prohibited ICE from making arrests at schools. International students and academics on work visas are also feeling afraid. Even U.S.-born citizens think, ‘If it can happen to them, it can happen to anyone.’ All of this has a severe impact on the community’s mental health.”

“But I want to emphasize that there is also resistance. School districts are creating sanctuary policies, mutual aid organizations, and ‘know your rights’ clinics. Some communities have patrols to prevent unlawful arrests. We’ve also seen massive protests, like in the case of Kilmer Abrego García, who was illegally deported to a prison in El Salvador. I don’t know how this is viewed in Chile, but there is certainly strong and active resistance to Trump.”

There’s a widespread belief that the U.S. economy depends significantly on the undocumented workforce. I recall a conversation I had with sociologist Wolfgang Streeck about Trump’s threats against immigrants. He thought Trump just wanted to scare people in order to prevent them from organizing or demanding their rights, but wouldn’t actually act because the economy would collapse. What do you think about that? And what do you believe will be the economic impact of these policies?

-Many assumed Trump’s priority was the economy and that he wouldn’t harm it, but that hasn’t been the case. In fact, when Joe Biden handed over the presidency to Trump, he left an extremely strong economy—The Economist called it the envy of the world. Now people talk about recession. Trump has implemented very damaging policies, like tariffs and dismantling the federal government, and some wonder what his game is or if he even cares about the economy.

“On immigration, Republicans used to support it because they benefited from undocumented labour. On the opposite end, big businesses also backed it because it helped fill the shortfall in skilled workers—doctors, engineers, lawyers—that our system doesn’t produce. So, there was a general understanding that immigration was fundamental to the U.S.”

“With this, I want to stress that undocumented immigrants are especially important, and if mass deportations were to happen, the consequences would be devastating. Let me share some statistics. The American Immigration Council estimates that mass deportations would cost an average of $88 billion annually and could exceed $350 billion over four years. One underreported fact is that in California alone in 2022, undocumented immigrants paid nearly $8.5 billion in state and local taxes (according to the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy), while nationally, the American Immigration Council found immigrants had paid almost $600 billion in taxes in 2022.”

“In California, the undocumented pay income, property, and sales taxes—and most importantly, they contribute to Social Security. In the U.S., undocumented workers are sustaining Social Security with their taxes. It’s ironic for Trump to claim that they don’t pay taxes, since he’s been using their tax data in order to identify and target them.”

LATINO MIDDLE CLASSES

Let’s discuss your book Barrios to Burbs on Mexican American middle-class mobility. What were the key factors that helped these groups climb the social ladder?

-I wanted to study the Mexican American middle class because much of the political and academic rhetoric insisted that Latinos would remain a racialized group stuck in the working or lower class. Many were surprised when I told them my research topic. They’d say, ‘That doesn’t exist,’ but then admit, ‘Oh, right, my accountant is Mexican American.’ People had internalized the idea that a Mexican American middle class was an impossibility—that only ‘exceptional cases’ existed.

“And what I found was that there were a series of key mechanisms for upward mobility, particularly in the cases of rapid intergenerational mobility (from poor or undocumented families to the middle class). One of those mechanisms was the public education system, which was able to recognize talent and also to support it. Those who ascended were primarily young people identified as ‘gifted’ and who had been placed in special programs or who had received external mentorship.”

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“Poor, low-educated Latino men disproportionately voted for Trump. But that is changing now.”

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“Another factor was legal status: families that obtained residency early had a series of cumulative advantages. In other words, the benefits of the parents’ legal status trickled down to their children, allowing them a more stable economic position. For example, they didn’t have to care for their parents because the latter had access to Social Security—something undocumented immigrants don’t have. This allowed the new generation to accumulate more wealth and to pay for better education for their own children. This placed families who entered with legal status in a position where their talent and effort could be rewarded. In short, legal status, educational opportunities, and external support were all key to breaking down barriers and enabling immigrants to begin accessing middle-tier levels.”

“There’s something else I want to mention. I also discovered that legal status in the U.S. was once linked to having children in the country. Many of my interviewees would say, ‘My parents got their papers when I was born,’ and I’d think they were mistaken because that’s not how our immigration laws work. But after researching archives, I confirmed that people did gain status when their children were born. This improved their economic condition and allowed them to rise rapidly into the middle class. This is relevant today, as we have 11 million undocumented immigrants with no pathways to regularization. My research shows that legal status functions as a mechanism for family mobility.”

Could Trump’s policies reverse the Latino mobility?

-Your question makes me think that if you want to create an underclass, don’t give them any opportunities to succeed. Instead, create structural blockages in institutions, stigmatize and dehumanize people and prevent them from attaining citizenship. I think we’re teetering on that precipice now. My colleagues Jennifer Lee and Min Zhou have shown that Mexican Americans are among the most successful immigrant groups—they double their parents’ educational attainment despite starting with less capital. They’ve achieved mobility in extreme contexts: their middle class is growing, and they find ‘shortcuts’ when faced with educational barriers. Legalization would boost their ability to contribute economically to the country, but some benefit more if they remain cheap, undocumented labor. On the other hand, I think Trump’s measures aren’t just about economics—they’re also racial.

Let’s talk about your current research on Latino elites. In a chapter you wrote for the Handbook of the Sociology of Global Elites, you explain how elites give back to their communities and describe the emergence of «ethno-racial capitalism.» Could you elaborate?

-Sure. Just as with my research on the middle class, I noticed a lacuna in the study of Latino elites. If you belong to business organizations in California, you know they exist, but academically, they were invisible. My findings show that these elites don’t turn their backs on the lower classes—partly because had many achieved their status recently and also grew up in poverty experiencing racism in their professional trajectories or hurdles in higher education. They know how hard it is, so they’re have a zeal for growing the Latino middle class and giving something back. Much of their philanthropic work focuses on supporting small business owners and advancing the chances of Latino youth in education.

“What’s interesting is that the Latino upper class—and often the middle class—leverage ethnicity in order to target co-ethnics and generate business. This led me to develop the concept of ethnic-racial capitalism, which refers to commodifying ethnic origin for economic gain. Examples include Latino grocery stores or the Latino cafés popping up across Southern California. Ethnicity also permeates institutions like Latino banks, one of the institutions I study. This capitalism is evident when the bank was founded or funded by Latinos, when employees are primarily Latino, when they highlight Spanish fluency, or say, ‘We understand what it means to be a Latino business owner—we can help you access capital.’ This capitalism is only possible when there’s a rising middle class—a group large enough to become an economic target. Today in Los Angeles, Latinos make up nearly 50% of the population and aren’t confined to a single neighborhood. Latino communities are spread across L.A., and you can see the various dimensions of this ethnic-racial capitalism at work.”

Poor, Trump-Supporting Latino Men

-I wonder how this Latino elite interprets Make America Great Again. That slogan harks back to an era when Latinos weren’t dominant in the U.S. Why would they support a candidate with that agenda?

-Two points here. First, I studied Latino elites during Trump’s first administration, and they were deeply troubled by his campaign and policies. Many wrote in The New York Times and The Wall Street Journal, trying to demonstrate Latinos’ value in U.S. society and combat Trump’s stereotypes—like the claim that undocumented immigrants drain the economy. They highlighted Latinos’ purchasing power, framing them as the rising new middle class and an economic engine. Even prominent Republican Latinos advocated for their ethnicity within Trump’s first presidency. I don’t know if this is still happening. There were Latinos in Trump’s 2020 campaign and in his cabinet (for example Marco Rubio), but it seems that they’re prioritizing class interests over ethnic ones.

“During Trump’s first administration, though, I saw people switching from the Republican to the Democratic Party due to Trump and his racist policies like Arizona’s 2010 ‘show me your papers’ law. Right-wing media’s scapegoating of Latinos for urban problems also impacted Latino elites at the time.”

“Secondly, Trump certainly does idealize an era when Latinos didn’t exist. People often ask me, ‘Why did more Latinos than ever vote for Trump?’ But that’s not entirely accurate. Preliminary data shows Latino support for Trump was concentrated in one group: low-income, less-educated men. They voted disproportionately for Trump. Some justified it economically, saying, ‘I feel excluded from this economy’—a sentiment shared by many low-income men in the U.S., regardless of ethnicity. I think another factor was at play: when your group is dehumanized and criminalized, you might distance yourself from it. One way to do that is to say, ‘I’m not like those criminal immigrants Trump talks about,’ aligning yourself with the group in power.”

“But Latino support has shifted. Now, when polled, most disagree with Trump—on immigration, the economy, and universities. I don’t know if this is getting international media attention, but in every poll, Trump’s numbers are in the red. He’s extremely unpopular across racial lines. So I think Latino support for Trump might be a temporary phenomenon which could change quickly by the 2026 midterms.”

Reading your book, it seems the ‘golden era’ for Latinos was during Barack Obama’s presidency, no?

-Yes. That was the golden age for the Latino middle class. For the elites, the best period was the end of the Obama era and the beginning of Trump’s presidency.

Why?

-Because Trump implemented policies favoring the oligarchy. But it’s important to note that Latino elite wealth doesn’t come close to that of billionaires.

So Latinos are part of the 1% but not the 0.001%?

-Correct. They’re at the top of the wealth distribution, but they’re not like Elon Musk or the tech bros who wield significant influence over national politics.

ACADEMIA WITH «FORBIDDEN WORDS»

What can you tell us about the administration’s attitude toward universities, particularly social sciences? I’ve heard many academics are worried Trump might cut funding for, say, gender studies.

-Today, academia is under attack. The Trump administration has tried to cancel various research funds—not just in social sciences but also in health research, where programs studying cancer or diabetes require an understanding ethnic or gender differences. To the Trump administration, this research promotes diversity, equity, and inclusion—perspectives that they simply won’t tolerate today.

“Personally, this affects me deeply because everything I study revolves around equity. Days ago, we received a list of words we can’t use if we want to attract state funding. My friends and I joked: ‘So now we must only study people who move from one place to another?’”

“Trump is attacking academic freedom and the social contract around education. Many colleagues have had grants rescinded or paused, leaving them unsure if they can pay their graduate students. Some research depends entirely on federal subsidies. The pressure is so intense that some have capitulated, while others are fighting back. Harvard, for instance, is countersuing the Trump administration. Faculty are forming mutual-aid pacts, and academic networks are mobilizing to defend higher education and our work.”

Where does the average citizen stand?

-The American public overwhelmingly disagrees with these attacks. Poll after poll shows strong opposition.

The fragmentation in the U.S. reminds me of Peter Turchin’s prediction of a potential civil war due to elite conflict. Do you think that’s possible?

-I believe the primary threat today is America’s democratic crisis. It’s well-known that Trump admires autocratic leaders and has meticulously followed a playbook for autocracy—Project 2025—written by figures fascinated by Viktor Orbán’s rise in Hungary, who are now in his cabinet. Everything that we’re seeing—the dismantling of federal agencies, foreign policy on Ukraine/Europe, the weaponizing of immigration laws against not just the undocumented but also against permanent residents and citizens, exploiting federal data—is deeply alarming. Many think the breaking point will come when Trump openly defies the courts. He’s already doing so in the case of Abrego García, who was deported to a Salvadoran prison, where he refuses a repatriation order. Add the attacks on academics, journalists, and media—this is all part of an authoritarian, anti-democratic playbook converging now… I hope the growing resistance continues.

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